for all you atheists out there... - Page 28

icecuban · 06-04-2007, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by All Else Failed

I care because it is a major subject in theology.

im sure u do, or else you wouldnt post so much im guessing. i guess i was kind of backing you, in saying that there is no difference between the god of ot or nt (before christ, after christ<---now). that violence is still going on, and its still from gods hand. but i think the best answer to the violence came in the form of a person who cared, a whole lot! the violence continues, but i think the way out was presented, that is, the example of how we should act "humanly", and care about others, even when we ourselves have nothing, was given. but as long as we do not act upright, then karma will continue this wheel of nasty.

pladecalvo · 05-11-2008, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by random guy 517

but isnt it better to anticipate some sort of afterlife rather than total nothingness? think about it...get back to me

Even Pascal admitted that his 'Wager' was seriously flawed!

Quote:

Originally Posted by random guy 517

good point, but that still doesnt give james or anybody for that matter the right to insult other peoples beliefs.

Nobody has the right to have their beliefs "respected". What if james believed that child pornography was a good thing? What if he believed that black people were inferior to whites or women inferior to men...would you give the same "respect" to his beliefs that you demand for yours? You can respect the person...it is not necessary to respect his beliefs. As Mencken said:

"The most curious social convention of the great age in which we live is the one to the effect that religious opinions should be respected."

and.....

"The way to deal with superstition is not to be polite to it, but to tackle it with all arms, and so rout it, cripple it, and make it forever infamous and ridiculous. Is it, perchance, cherished by persons who should know better? Then their folly should be brought out into the light of day, and exhibited there in all its hideousness until they flee from it, hiding their heads in shame. True enough, even a superstitious man has certain inalienable rights. He has a right to harbor and indulge his imbecilities as long as he pleases, provided only he does not try to inflict them upon other men by force. He has a right to argue for them as eloquently as he can, in season and out of season. He has a right to teach them to his children. But certainly he has no right to be protected against the free criticism of those who do not hold them. He has no right to demand that they be treated as sacred. He has no right to preach them without challenge. Did Darrow, in the course of his dreadful bombardment of Bryan, drop a few shells, incidentally, into measurably cleaner camps? Then let the garrisons of those camps look to their defenses. They are free to shoot back. But they can't disarm their enemy."
-- H L Mencken

Quote:

Originally Posted by OUZBnd

If any of you non-religious types can prove that God doesn't exist then maybe you will have a chance of converting religious types.

: Prove Zeus doesn't exist. A failure to prove he doesn't will be taken as a reason to suppose he does. The burden of proof is on them to produce the evidence that their god exists...not for us to prove he doesn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by memento_mori

....and what's this nonsense about Him knowing whether you are going to heaven or hell before hand?

"You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

Quote:

Originally Posted by All Else Failed

God knows all ------> He knows how we will act.

Since he knows all, he will know how we will act ------> He makes us that way

A god that knows all, and makes beings that he already knows the outcome of their lives, is predestination. Since he knows how we will act, when we will sin and such, he already knows who will go to hell or not. Your actions in this life are meaningless.

Precisely! If the Christian god is omniscient as alleged.....predestination is the only outcome. Free-will and omniscience can't co-exist.

Quote:

Originally Posted by All Else Failed

Believing in something that cannot be proven, documented, tested, recorded, or be provided with physical evidence usually falls into the "delusional" category. I'm sure you would call someone who claims to be in contact with a alien mothership delusional. But, the term delusional isnt an insulting thing really. .

Every day of their lives, theists use reason, logic and critical thinking to dismiss thousands of examples of primitive, superstitious, imaginary deities. Now why don’t they use that very same logic and critical thinking with which they dismiss leprechauns, unicorns, mermaids and other superstitious nonsense....to dismiss their own superstitious beliefs.Strange isn't it?

Sparkey Duck · 05-11-2008, 06:45 AM

I prefer the newer locals.. wait.. Oh Sorry

Sorry, I thought it was a thread for anaesthetists.. I'll be moving along

Mase · 05-11-2008, 07:05 AM

I'm half agnostic and half someone who doesn't give a crap.

All Else Failed · 05-11-2008, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pladecalvo

Even Pascal admitted that his 'Wager' was seriously flawed!

Nobody has the right to have their beliefs "respected". What if james believed that child pornography was a good thing? What if he believed that black people were inferior to whites or women inferior to men...would you give the same "respect" to his beliefs that you demand for yours? You can respect the person...it is not necessary to respect his beliefs. As Mencken said:

"The most curious social convention of the great age in which we live is the one to the effect that religious opinions should be respected."

and.....

"The way to deal with superstition is not to be polite to it, but to tackle it with all arms, and so rout it, cripple it, and make it forever infamous and ridiculous. Is it, perchance, cherished by persons who should know better? Then their folly should be brought out into the light of day, and exhibited there in all its hideousness until they flee from it, hiding their heads in shame. True enough, even a superstitious man has certain inalienable rights. He has a right to harbor and indulge his imbecilities as long as he pleases, provided only he does not try to inflict them upon other men by force. He has a right to argue for them as eloquently as he can, in season and out of season. He has a right to teach them to his children. But certainly he has no right to be protected against the free criticism of those who do not hold them. He has no right to demand that they be treated as sacred. He has no right to preach them without challenge. Did Darrow, in the course of his dreadful bombardment of Bryan, drop a few shells, incidentally, into measurably cleaner camps? Then let the garrisons of those camps look to their defenses. They are free to shoot back. But they can't disarm their enemy."
-- H L Mencken

: Prove Zeus doesn't exist. A failure to prove he doesn't will be taken as a reason to suppose he does. The burden of proof is on them to produce the evidence that their god exists...not for us to prove he doesn't.

"You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

Precisely! If the Christian god is omniscient as alleged.....predestination is the only outcome. Free-will and omniscience can't co-exist.

Every day of their lives, theists use reason, logic and critical thinking to dismiss thousands of examples of primitive, superstitious, imaginary deities. Now why don’t they use that very same logic and critical thinking with which they dismiss leprechauns, unicorns, mermaids and other superstitious nonsense....to dismiss their own superstitious beliefs.Strange isn't it?

Yes, free will is simply silly.

Cajun Fox · 05-12-2008, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by random guy 517

if im not mistaken, you all believe that there are no godlike beings, thus no afterlife. when you die, you die, end of discussion.

but i have a question...normally when you cannot remember something, its as if that never happened (like infant years). so when you die, your brain ceases to function, so you cant remember ANYTHING. therefore, from your perspective, you never existed.

(im going to hell for this statement) i am aware that organized religion seems to be similar to a cult...

(dont reply yet)

We exist. You only get one life to live...that's it. After that there is no afterlife or anything...you're literally screwed by then.

Minor Axis · 05-22-2008, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOriginalJames

Let me ask you this; if there is an after life which is eternal, what is the point of this life?

If thinking in philosophical terms life on earth is like the ultimate simulation, you experience it, learn something from it, become a better person/entity for it, and hopefully take these lessons with you for your next life on Earth (or wherever, heaven if you prefer). I don't mean to say you actually remember events from a former life, but it's something at your core that makes you better or maybe you fall down and become worse and come back as a bug, who knows. BTW I'm open to the possibility of reincarnation, but I'm not sold on it.

In contrast if the purpose of your life is to live on Earth for a number of years, raise a family, go to work, etc, then you die and it's all over, what's the point of that? I'm not saying it could not be that way, but I prefer to believe the former.

TheOriginalJames · 05-22-2008, 08:05 PM

What matters to me is that here and now, with this life, I am concious of myself, surroundings, and others. This is all I know, and I'm not going to worry about what goes on with me after this is over. That would make this absolutely unnecessary.

DavyBoy · 05-22-2008, 09:57 PM

hmm I'm going to do my whole those-28-pages-don't-exist thing and reply to the first post.

Randomguy. The idea of an afterlife is far, far more appealing than eternal nothingness. Eternal nothingness scares the shit out of me.

So what? It is also the far, far more logical outcome. This is obviously the case, so what you are saying is that we should believe something simply because we want to. I'd like to believe that I'm going to somehow stumble upon 1,000,000 dollars tomorrow, but that's not going to happen either.

DaveM · 05-23-2008, 08:30 AM

I don't beleive in god, but I beleive in an afterlife, not the traditional heaven/hell thing though

05-11-2008, 06:45 AM	#408
Sparkey Duck Avian anonymous Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Down at the bottom of the garden. Posts: 2,614 Tokenz: 337	Re: for all you atheists out there... I prefer the newer locals.. wait.. Oh Sorry Sorry, I thought it was a thread for anaesthetists.. I'll be moving along __________________ ...and so i said to my Doctor, "you can keep your Somatopsychic depersonalisation theories thank you very much. I've had some pretty flipped out dreams where i'm anthropomorphizing into various aquatic life forms, but a diagnosis like that will serve only to encourage me!"

05-11-2008, 07:05 AM	#409
Mase 1924 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia. Posts: 3,396 Tokenz: 17,799	Re: for all you atheists out there... I'm half agnostic and half someone who doesn't give a crap. __________________ R.I.P. Isaac Hayes. He did a good job as Chef from South Park, and he's made some pretty good music.

05-22-2008, 08:05 PM	#413
TheOriginalJames The one and only Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 24,654 Tokenz: 39,315	Re: for all you atheists out there... What matters to me is that here and now, with this life, I am concious of myself, surroundings, and others. This is all I know, and I'm not going to worry about what goes on with me after this is over. That would make this absolutely unnecessary. __________________ You're beautiful

05-22-2008, 09:57 PM	#414
DavyBoy DH+MM=Good Maths ♥ Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Canberra, Australia Posts: 216 Tokenz: 1,204	Re: for all you atheists out there... hmm I'm going to do my whole those-28-pages-don't-exist thing and reply to the first post. Randomguy. The idea of an afterlife is far, far more appealing than eternal nothingness. Eternal nothingness scares the shit out of me. So what? It is also the far, far more logical outcome. This is obviously the case, so what you are saying is that we should believe something simply because we want to. I'd like to believe that I'm going to somehow stumble upon 1,000,000 dollars tomorrow, but that's not going to happen either. __________________ "I don't want to achieve immortality through my work. I want to achieve it through not dying." - Woody Allen David. Matilde did this. ^^ She did that too. ^^

05-23-2008, 08:30 AM	#415
DaveM I R DA MANGO PIRATE! YARR Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: in my basement, making a suit of skin Posts: 1,811 Tokenz: 8,174	Re: for all you atheists out there... I don't beleive in god, but I beleive in an afterlife, not the traditional heaven/hell thing though __________________

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